I’m spending the evening confirming odd facts I’m using in my upcoming political book. Here are a few things I’ve learned:
While I call the mystic leader of the dervishes Mevlana, I guess most people refer to him as Rumi. It was the former editor of Reader’s Digestthat was made chairman of the board of the Corporation for Public Broadcasting (illustrating how, rather than zeroing out PBS, the Bush administration wanted to give it a lobotomy). While “e pluribus unum” is our motto, Europe’s is “in varietate concordia” (united in diversity). I thought Berlin was one of the world’s biggest “Turkish cities” — but with 113,000 Turks, it would be only the 50th largest city in Turkey. Tirol includes parts of Italy and Austria, but not in inch of Germany. The female president of Finland is well into her second six-year term, running one of the most highly taxed countries anywhere, and she maintains her 75 percent approval rating. (What does she give those Finns for all that money?) I’m loving getting this book written.
Perhaps you can help me. I need to confirm figures on WWI that I remember from my college professor. I seem to remember that the French lost huge numbers of people in one day many times, and that by the end of WWI half of all the French men between the age of 15 and 30 were casualties. Can anyone tell me what the bloodiest single days in WWI were for the French? (For example, the British lost 20,000 on the first day of the Battle of the Somme.) Also, what was the population of France in 1914, and then what percent of its men (ages 15-30) were killed (or killed or wounded) in that “War to End All Wars”?
Thanks.
August 22, 1914 “The Battle of the Frontiers” — 27,000 French soldiers die on this single day in an offensive thrust to the east of Paris, towards the German borders. Rick, you may be able to get some more information that you need at this link. http://www.worldwar1.com/tlwarorg.htm
Rick………………This is news….upcoming political book…..that sounds very interesting……………it would be interesting to know your views in a book as often they are mixed with other topics……….can you give us some clues on the book and when it might be available……. sorry I don’t have any WW1 stats to help out….. today’s word: viaduct
Rick you should realy say European Union instead of Europe because Switzerland is part of Europe but not the EU and they do not incorporate this as their motto. United in Diversity, or Unity in Diversity, (is translated into all 23 languages / Latin: In varietate concordia) was adopted as the European Union’s motto in 2000 following an unofficial process. Unity in Diversity was selected from entries proposed by school pupils submitted to the website http://www.devise-europe.org, and then accepted by the President of the European Parliament, Nicole Fontaine. United in diversity was written into the English-language version of the failed European Constitution, and now appears on official EU websites.
Google WWI casualties. You will find many choices of information. It has a chart of the casualties, etc.
Rick, per John Keegan’s authoritative book “The First World War:” By the end of 1914, four months after the outbreak of the Great War, 300,000 Frenchmen had been killed, 600,000 wounded, out of a male population of twenty million, perhaps ten million of military age. By the end of the war, nearly two million Frenchmen were dead, the majority from the infantry, the major arm of the service, which had lost 22% of those enlisted. The heaviest casualties had been suffered by the youngest year-groups: between 27% and 30% of the conscript classes of 1912-15. Many of those young men were not yet married. By 1918, however, there were 630,000 war widows in France and a very large number of younger women deprived by the war of the chance to marry. The imbalance between the sexes of those aged 20-39 stood in 1921 at 45 males to 55 females. The book is well indexed so you might be able to find specific answers to your other questions. BTW, we visited Verdun a couple of years ago. Seeing that battlefield and the museums brought home the horrors of that conflict and the sacrifices made.
Looking forward to the book!
My grandfather fought at Verdun on the Western Front in WWI. That may be the battle you’re looking for.
another essential WW1 book would be The Guns of August by Barbara W. Tuchman
Rick, Can’t wait until you get the book finished and published! Mallory
It is an interesting different between “E Pluribus Unum” and “In Varietate Concordia”. We value diversity of cultures, but nothing is as valuable or as strong as unity of purpose and beliefs among people. I remember a diversity training seminar I attended where two individuals attacked the concept of the melting pot as being passé. What they promoted is the value of the salad bowl where all the different parts are present. I thought it was rubbish. Through that salad up in the air and let it fall; does it stick together? That is the recipe for balkanization. Diversity for its own sake is the worst form of nationalism. What unity should exist in a country or in politics? If diversity is valued above unity, you do not have a country, a nation, or a people; rather all you have is civil war, chaos, and anarchy. What is needed is the acceptance of difference, but the commitment of a people to specific ideals. When that unity of ideals is sacrificed on the alter of diversity, humanity is diminished, the heart is hardened, and civilization’s foundation becomes sand. As my grandmother used to say, “be careful what you ask for; one day you might just get it.”
EDITING MY COMMENT FOR CLARITY. There is an interesting difference between “E Pluribus Unum” and “In Varietate Concordia”. The second one values diversity of cultures, but has little unity. I believe there is nothing as valuable in civilization as a strong unity of purpose and moral standards among people. I remember attending a diversity training seminar where two individuals spent the first part of their presentation attacking the concept of the melting pot; in their opinion it false and passé. What they promoted is the “better” concept of the salad bowl where all the different parts are present. “See how good a salad is and no one has lost their identity.” At the time I thought it was rubbish and missed completely the value of a unified citizenry. Throw that salad up in the air and let it fall; does it stick together? No! It immediately falls apart. What it is a recipe for balkanization. Diversity for its own sake produces the worst form of nationalism. A question worth thinking about: what unity should exist in a country or in politics? When is it appropriate to be diverse and when is unity called for? If diversity is valued above unity, you do not have a country, a nation, or a people; what you end up with is a civil war, chaos, and anarchy. What is needed is the acceptance of difference, but the commitment of a people to specific ideals. When that unity of ideals is sacrificed on the alter of diversity, humanity is diminished, our hearts are hardened, and civilization’s foundation becomes sand. As my grandmother used to say, “be careful what you ask for; one day you might just get it.”
Professor Humberd your services are required…..
Yes, where is the distinguished Mr. Humberd? I hope he is well.
Wow, am I in trouble. As I read Michael B’s post, I said hooray, that is exactly what I have been trying to say for years, but Michael said it best. Then here comes Fred and Thomas (kidding or serious??) so I must add something. I am not old enough to remember W.W.I, but are you surprised that I have a story? Sweetie’s German Cousin Fina, had been an aide in a US Army Hospital after the First World War. She had an autograph book filled with words of thanks, and love notes, from her “patients.†The German word for pillow is “Kissen,†and of course we believed Cousin Fina when she said that each time a soldier asked for a kiss she brought him a Kissen. Well, that’s almost on the subject. But I will add: It’s obvious the English are different from the Germans, who are different from the French, who are different from the Italians, who are different from the Greeks, who are different from – Viva La Difference! That’s diversity as it is intended to be, from country to country.
A delight, Mr. Humbred.
Rick, You might be interested in General Butler. Twice awarded the Medal of Honor. He wrote a very insightful book and speech called “War is a Racket”. Talks a lot about WWI and WWII. Might want to make a sandwich and op a soda, as it is about a 1/2 hour read. I’ll include a link here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Is_a_Racket
Jim, Thanks for the story about Cousin Fina, it was cute. Your theory of diversity, however, is bizarre at best. Countries are not museum pieces, frozen in time to reflect only those aspects of the culture that you consider “authentic.” To me, part of Rick’s travel philosophy is to experience Europe as it is, not as you would like it to be. And, if you truly believe what you espouse, then why shouldn’t we all leave the US to the Native Americans who settled it first?? Other than them, we are all immigrants. I’m not trying to pick a fight but I feel the need to respond.
Not sure if this is redundant, or even if it’s what you’re looking for, Rick, but the Battle of Verdun is credited with being one of the bloodiest battles on record though it lasted for longer than one day. Here’s what Wikipedia says about it: “The Battle of Verdun resulted in more than a quarter of a million deaths and at least a million wounded. Verdun was the longest battle and one of the bloodiest in World War I and more generally in human history. In both France and Germany it has come to represent the horrors of war, similar to the significance of the Battle of the Somme to the United Kingdom, the Battle of Gallipoli to Australia and New Zealand, or the Battle of Gettysburg to the United States.” In any event it was a particuarly horrible battle.
I second the recommendation of “War is a Racket”. Quick read and a lot of first hand information. Michael L, I’m not sure how you interpreted what you did from Jimmy H. I don’t really see it as a reference to coutries frozen in time but rather a nod to the diversity that exists from nation to nation. The autograph book may refer to that period of time but the title of this post does indeed refer to WWI and asks for imformation from that specific time period. Oh well, as you stated I’m not looking for a fight either just some friendly and informative banter. Go IRISH!!
Micheal L. you present unrealistic and very tired arguments. You make broad paint brush stroke-y analogies. Jim Humberd is a fine human being with very valid points and is well respected on this board. Good day sir.
Michael L -You said, “Countries are not museum pieces, frozen in time†and I could not agree more. But I say a culture must be developed by long time citizens of a country, not forced on anyone by people who hated a culture bad enough to escape, then trys to force it on the home they moved to. If your culture was bad enough to leave, don’t try to force it on me. Wouldn’t it be terrible if all parts of the world were the same. I travel to see how other people live, not to force them to live my way. And this is not only between countries. When people say the US is “…one nation, indivisible …†consider the few similarities and the many differences between the Maine lobster trapper and his home and way of life, with the cowboy in Montana, and with the people who live on the mountain-side above Beverly Hills in Southern California! Not major differences that would make the people incompatible and contentious, but a shade of difference, that adds character and interest to both the people and their land. The US is “… one nation, indivisible … †with many differences!
Jim, Jim, Jim. I’ve never met someone so well-traveled who still clings to such a simplistic, distorted, culturally arrogant worldview. In the vast majority of cases, people don’t emigrate from a country because they “hated [the] culture,” but for political or socioeconomic reasons. If the choice is between staying in the country you love and starving to death or being trampled by an oppressive regime, or getting a new start somewhere, I can hardly blame someone for moving…and for bringing their culture with them. It’s also outrageous for you, a privileged white man (which I also am), to portray yourself as the victim, asserting that other people are “forcing” their culture on you. Have you ever chosen to eat at a Mexican or a Chinese restaurant? Did the waiter hold a gun to your head while you ate the fajitas? Or do you just enjoy getting a taste of something different every now and again? Diversity is what makes this country great–in fact, it’s what this country was founded on–and to suggest otherwise is frankly unpatriotic.
Well here is a third topic for the messageboard – the sex trade in Europe! I just read a very interesting article in the Economist (http://www.economist.com/world/international/displayStory.cfm?source=hptextfeature&story_id=12516582) and was wondering if Rick or others of you had any thoughts that you’d like to share. Perhaps I wasn’t reading Europe Through the Backdoor 2008 close enough, but I didn’t realize that organized crime was still involved with Amsterdam’s prosititution.
Jim, Maybe if you keep trying, I’ll figure out what you are trying to say. Based on your persistence, I’m willing to assume you have a point in there somwhere. But right now, your argument just sounds like gibberish and I can’t decode it.
This topic remains of interest to me. Those who tout the beauty of diversity at the expense of everything else are really only supportive of that diversity if it fits into their moral parameters. For example, how many times did Rick knock the Iranians for the suppressed position of women. Why knock the their culture or their social structure? Don’t we value diversity? This culture has obviously worked for hundreds of years. If we all really supported diversity we would value this difference and support these societies completely without reservation. A similar response can easily be found on most college campuses that say they support diversity…unless someone thinks differently (read conservatively). Then all hell breaks loose and professors are drummed out of the university for not being “enlightened”. I seldom find someone that honestly, truly believes in diversity in the US; what I find are people who like others to think like them. Liberals and conservatives say they believe in diversity, but both are hypocritical. There is a wide difference between world cultural diversity and diversity within a nation. It is error to think of them as being the same thing.
One of the most provocative books I’ve recently read about World War I and the one I ask my (college) students to read is “14-18: Understanding the Great War” by Ste’phane Audoin-Rouzeau and Annette Becker. I like the book because it takes a serious look at the new nature of industrialized violence and also the how the continent mourned its dead and wounded. In US classrooms, we talk about the war and then move straight to the bubbly ‘Jazz Years.’ These French historians push us to think about the collective grief of its survivors in ways that simply listing demographics of the dead has difficulty describing. There is an especially interesting chapter on the public memorials that became nearly universal throughout European villages, towns, and cities.
Rick how about hiring a grad student in history from say the University of Washington to help you I am sure they can use the money.
http://www.pbs.org/greatwar/resources/casdeath_pop.html As I was preparing for today’s lecture, I ‘rediscovered’ PBS’s excellent website on The Great War. I know that it doesn’t address all of the specific statistics that you are looking for, but it might help you get headed in the right direction.